It is "full-range-of-motion" Going any deeper won't give you more benefits. Measurable progress is what it is. Your other source is just some dude's opinion on the matter. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, Discussion of physical fitness/exercise goals and how they can be achieved, Press J to jump to the feed. ATG is as much a full ROM squat as someone who just passes parallel. Squatting to parallel is the safest and most effective way to squat. Muscle activation is a single variable and frankly a pretty contentious variable. However, i asked him about squat depth wrt knee health to see what he would say. Muscle activation between all three variations (and yes, between front and back squats) is very similar. So I'm 19 years old been lifting for about 3 years now and just ended a program two weeks ago and am now focusing on building leg strength, using the smolov jr. program. That said, I don't think any part of my post argues against full range of motion squatting. I didn't account for the fact that people wouldn't go and read all 176 words of it. any tips to help me overcome this? With heavy load on that reversal it is bad. Found an interesting article while searching for an article to use for my paper. 28.00. Reddit. Too many times we try to get into a below parallel squatting position only to compromise our low back and ineffectively recruit our glutes and hamstrings. There are myths that suggest squatting below parallel is a bad idea and that it leads to knee and hip problems. This would be a squat below parallel! But the second I try squatting below parallel with even just the bar, my form just crumbles. But it's actually the other way around! Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. These are things that studies ignore that stop them from being definitive answers. Deeper squats below parallel do not lead to greater glute activation. No, not necessarily. Squatting below parallel with sh*tty form is probably worse on the knees than doing a half squat. The trend with lifting especially with females is squatting for a more shapely lower body, this paper addresses the fact that you need not squat ATG to achieve these desired results. Specifically they were talking about glute and hip activity. If you go half the distance, your muscles are only doing half the work because Work = Force x Distance. Alan Thrall 913,152 views. Time under tension for deep squat is greater for each set with the same number of reps vs parallell squats. The below-parallel (hips just below the knees) squat position is a perfectly natural position for the human body. This would be a squat below parallel! I have been doing well with squats but I'm having a hard time going below parallel because i am afraid of losing my balance or not getting the weight up. Don't just go … This study simply demonstrates that when using EMG muscle activation is very similar. 4) you can't look at muscle activation and try to extrapolate hypertrophy from it directly. Note: An athlete with short femurs who squats to parallel with 500 pounds is doing less work than a lifter with long femurs squatting 500 to parallel. So, less ROM can be compensated for by using more load. If you are in a more active position full ass to grass then you are not reversing and the load is not a bad thing. And the parts not supported by the abstract are supported by the full text and other studies in their reference list (particularly http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12173958 and http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23604798). 28.00. As you move past this point and into a full-depth position the pressure of your thigh and calf compressing together creates a support for the knee. I've written quite a bit about why that's the case, and why you'd want that to be the case. https://www.dropbox.com/s/6sdsnihdn1rtq3i/Screenshot%202015-08-08%2020.21.04.png?dl=0, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12173958, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23604798. Here's the answer. Cliff notes: Deeper squats below parallel do not lead to greater glute activation (this is in conflict with Caterisano et al. I've been having pain in my anus after doing deadlifts and squats below parallel, and on multiple occasions people on forums have told me to use a butt plug because apparently I'm most likely clenching too much at the bottom of both lifts, but it's probably worse on the squats. Muscle reasons: You activate and stimulate more of your leg muscles, which is why you're squatting in the first place. email. The lead author of the study seems to agree with me: https://www.dropbox.com/s/6sdsnihdn1rtq3i/Screenshot%202015-08-08%2020.21.04.png?dl=0. Sorry for not posting the entire abstract (or that specific part). Reddit. 28.00. This is the difference between the deadlift and the romanian deadlift, though your ROM is reduced with the romanian dl, your glutes and hamstrings are getting hit much harder and are fatiguing. I recently found a workout partner for ‘leg day’. We all know you can squat more weight above parallel, NOT IMPRESSIVE. 28.00. He also happens to lift quite a lot. r/fitness doesn't understand buttwink. Hip pain, below parallel squat I've been following SS, and steadily incrementing the weight every workout 3 times a week, for about 8 weeks. However, given the results of previous research, it is recommended that individuals utilize a full range of motion when squatting, assuming full range can be safely achieved, in order to promote more favorable training adaptations. Basically ATG squats aren't feasible for some people so it's more important to find a comfortable ROM for your leverages. This will occur because you’re not looking down, you’re not shoving your knees out, you have a stance that is either too narrow or too wide, or you have not committed to going deep. Hi, I started squatting again last week after 2 months off with 135 lbs on the bar (high bar position) with the same stance I've always taken (feet slightly wider than hips, toes pointed slightly out), my knees did begin to buckle in towards the last few reps of the third set in subsequent workouts and I ended up with a pain deep in my hip joints whenever I squatted below parallel. 3) the squat works your glutes and quads WAY harder than it works your hamstrings. Also, muscles are more prone to damage in the stretched position) also plays a major role. There's a good article on TNation about it. In fact, dropping below parallel is easier on knees than a partial-depth movement [i] .The highest forces on your knee joint during a squat occur at 90 degrees, not at full-depth. The parallel position is lower than you think, and most people — even longtime lifters — … THICC- Blue/Blue. Those … Also think about the amount of work. Squatting Past Parallel—Is It Bad for Your Knees? Yeah that makes total sense and i see that same argument every time but the problem is that for me to go below parallel i would need to perform a wider stance and for some reason during my wider stance squats my feet turn/twist outwards instead of remaining slightly parallel/ facing forward, which worries me a lot and then reduces my motivation to squat heavier. Hamstrings? CrossFit - Squatting Below Parallel with Adrian Bozman ... High Bar Squat vs. Low Bar Squat - Duration: 9:25. Squatting below parallel is a fundamental human movement, we see it in toddlers and babies without any coaching because it is just that natural. Play around and find a hip angle allows you to pull your knee the furthest- try bringing your knee out to the side rather than straight toward your head. If you have the typical adult hip and ankle mobility, you may very well have to stop when your thighs are parallel to the floor—and that’s perfectly fine. 28.00. In countless websites and articles about exercising during pregnancy, you will commonly read that women should not squat below parallel (in which the knees are at a 90 degree angle) during pregnancy due to the loosening effects of the relaxin hormone on joints and ligaments during pregnancy. Correct me if I'm way off target here but in my experience a deep squat takes longer than a parallell squat. Most people find that if they bottom out 2 inches below parallel, it’s a lot easier to complete the lift if they go 2 inches below parallel rather than cutting the squat right at parallel. Alan Thrall 913,152 views. This has been a burning question that have been thinking about and haven't asked the people at my gym about. I would imagine that ROM is good regardless of the exercise. With a 10rm load, peak glute and quad activation are really high, along with average quad activation. He has a book called Strong Curves that's pretty popular. Fitness professionals often debate the proper depth for heavy loaded squats, and whether you should stop at parallel or go ass-to-grass. In the fitness world, much emphasis is placed on being able to squat below parallel—meaning squatting to a depth where your hip crease is below your knee. No two lifters are the same, so why should they all use the same squat position? THICC- Blonde. Starting Strength (Kindle Locations 778-780). To stop above parallel is basically saying fuck thousands of years of evolution that have made this such an integral part of our movement patterns. Although many good articles have been written about squatting, coaches are still frequently confronted with “do not go below parallel or 90°”, “you shouldn’t bring your knees past your toes”, or “squats are bad for your back”. Not too much going on there. yep, seems like a lot of people missed that (which is reflected in my fourth point). He's moving the weight over a shorter distance. Below Parallel Squat Club- Gold/Black. I just want to know if it is seriously bad if i don't go below parallel during my squats or is going parallel just fine during squats. THICC- Blonde. I’ve done ankle and hip mobility stuff and it just doesn’t seem to help ‍♀️ I progress just fine squatting to parallel but I know below gets the most depth. This one examined hip and thigh muscle activity between full squats, parallel squats, and front squats in trained women. Essentially it is all down to the stress on the knee. Thought I would share some info I gained from the abstract. When my partner squats, he is below parallel. Going below parallel rather than stopping at parallel reduces shear forces at the knee. Below Parallel Squat Club- Blue. I asked my partner to critique my squat form and he tells me I’m falling short of parallel. This is because the tension on the muscle depends on the joint angle, which is why triceps push downs are easy to lock out at the end, but a bitch in the middle. CrossFit - Squatting Below Parallel with Adrian Bozman ... High Bar Squat vs. Low Bar Squat - Duration: 9:25. If not, that means you are compressing your joints and connective tissue into positions they can’t naturally move into. You activate all the proper muscles instead of needing assistance work to make up for the imbalances. Debajo de Paralelo- Antique Gold/Black. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. That being said, there are reasons to do half-squats too, often sports related, and spot specific related, but the general squat should remain a below parallel thing. I'm not an expert by any means but I think we can safely say that /u/gnuckols is as evidenced by his reply to this comment and his articles/videos. And in this case if you only ever squat above parallel you're leaving the weakest part of … There are other factors involved of course, but it is to illustrate a point. Below Parallel Squat Club- Gold/Black. Many things have been blamed for not being able to go parallel with squats (free barbell or bodyweight), and often, the most likely culprit gets overlooked. Greg Nuckols of Stengtheory (/u/gnuckols) had some interesting comments to summarize (on his own Facebook post): a squat is a squat is a squat. There really isn't much of a difference in hip and thigh muscle activity between the different squat variations we tested. It's like arguing that we only need to bench to 90 degree elbows. 28.00. There's a lot of misinformation in the fitness community. email. There's almost a mentality that if you aren't doing ATG squats you can't work your legs out. Cookies help us deliver our Services. In the end: the only one you're really cheating by not going to parallel is yourself. I have a question about Squat form. I think time under tension is kinda overhyped though, it's mainly just a metabolic/fatigueing stress, which is relevant, but I dunno where I'm goin.. Just squat whichever way you like the most, or (I know, blasphemy) if you don't like squats, don't squat at all. Have you read the full text yet, by any chance? Yes, but time under tenson can also be lengthened by simply not locking out the knees and not resting between sets at the top. 28.00. It's technically true but 'solves' the problem by circumventing it. It did not address which applies more stress or torque to your knees. New Bret Contreras (and team) article published: A Comparison of Gluteus Maximus, Biceps Femoris, and Vastus Lateralis EMG Amplitude in the Parallel, Full, and Front Squat Variations in Resistance Trained Females. Bret Contreras seems to be pretty focused on helping women build glutes; that's his specialty. If you're just squatting to generally improve leg and hip strength, it really doesn't matter how you squat. It's a simple way for judges to ascertain, as fairly as possible, whether someone did a "complete" repetition on the competition platform. The below-parallel (hips just below the knees) squat position is a perfectly natural position for the human body. Hip Pain when squatting below Parallel Howdy gang! edit: yep, downvote sound advice, enjoy your quarter squats. … However, the safety of deep squatting remains highly questioned. Yes. It is, and this OP is retarded. But it's actually the other way around! Not everyone can squat below parallel with ease, but if you can, there are some compelling reasons to do so. This simple rule demarcates a clear standard to … Squatting deep makes the transition to more advanced exercises, such as clean and snatch, easier. My team just got another article accepted! And in this case if you only ever squat above parallel you're leaving the weakest part of … Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. “Below parallel” to me is when your back is straight, and u go down and feel your whole ass start to stretch from the tension, then go lower while maintaining that straight back form - until u feel to lose tension in the ass region, when it starts to begin to feel like cheating (avoid the full ass to grass cause u lose all tension) and then spring back up When you cut a squat higher than your natural bottom position, assuming you’re still squatting to some position below your sticking point, you have to reverse the weight purely with active muscular effort instead of also getting a boost from … All this study shows is that the muscle activation in most squats is very similar which means that people who spend a lot of time arguing about what form and range are absolutely correct are objectively stupid. Below Parallel Squat Club- Blue. Now say you go half-way to your squat (I know you are saying parallel but if you are new it is often hard to judge that), you do not have that same reflex meaning that to change directions you are placing tension on your knees because that is how you are going to have to change directions. Going below parallel activates a natural stretch reflex, that puts less pressure on your knees. I think it breaks down into two camps. Although many good articles have been written about squatting, coaches are still frequently confronted with “do not go below parallel or 90°”, “you shouldn’t bring your knees past your toes”, or “squats are bad for your back”. 28.00. Range of motion (particularly stretch, which may cause some hypertrophy signaling by itself. A lot of ideas (which aren't rigorous) seem to build a lot of steam in almost a cult-like manner. Measuring just biceps femoris and vastus lateralis is pretty standard. This is exactly why trying to extrapolate serious practical implications from a single controlled trial is pretty pointless. Knees are not really designed to bear a lot of weight at angles much beyond 90 degrees. Arch Logo- Tie Dye- Custom Tie Dye- (read description on coloring) 30.00. sold out. This study is totally interesting but as far as how it should affect your training? I would consider this sufficient for both strength and hypertrophy goals. Correct me if I'm way off target here but in my experience a deep squat takes longer than a parallell squat. Dude, the point is most people here feel squats are "useless" unless they are ATG. Depth: You’re probably going to squat to a position above parallel. And not just because failing to squat below parallel equals a no rep at a powerlifting or CrossFit competition…. 28.00. parallel and deep squats performed below parallel. It did not investigate which variation had greater sport transfer or carry over. Squatting deep, below where your thighs are parallel to the floor has advantages that you don’t get from partial squats or parallel squats. Before thinking about squatting below parallel you need to honestly evaluate if you can squat that low with stability and comfort without using weight. I feel its a measure of precaution especially because of the way our bodies are changing during this time and with our altered center of gravity. If you squat because the squat is part of your sport (powerlifting) then squat in whatever manner allows you to lift the most weight. I ached like it was the first time I've squatted to after weeks of doing half Squats then correcting my form, which shows how much more the muscles were being worked, if you don't go below parallel or full depth you will need a shit ton of assistance work, Comparison reasons: By going below parallel you have a measurable stat that you can compare to anyone else in the world that follows the "same set of rules". Correct me if I am wrong I think the article solely is stating that it just is not activating any more of your glutes. Squatting above parallel is safest for the knee much in the same way abstinence is the safest way to avoid an STD. It’s both a question of your current mobility and strength levels, and one of what your build will or won’t allow. I foresee someone asking if quarter reps on isolation work, like curls, would then be the same if you did twice as many reps. Well, not likely because you'd probably start to affect the force side of the equation. There is a lot of different opinions on how effective squats are that aren’t below parallel. Think of it this way, you have a natural movement that is the squat, you go below parallel and your stretch reflex is activated so instead of there being pressure on switching directions (going down -> going up) it is handled in that reflex. Rippetoe, Mark (2013-11-07). It did not argue for which is better for hypertrophy. You can feel the natural elasticity you mention when you reach the bottom and spring back up. Tension isn't lost at all throughout the set. 2) can we please bury the myth you have to squat ass to grass because hamstrings co-contraction will protect your knees, but only if you bounce your ass off your ankles? This happens immediately after hitting parallel. Despite the bad advice and misunderstandings of some, the deep squat is not hard on your knees. A squat below parallel is when your hip crease is below your knee, also known as ass to grass or ATG’s for short. Sometimes, when people squat really deep, they need to relax their butt to make up for the lack of depth and that is where the not squatting below parallel comes in. Just in general, Bret does a lot of work with female athletes. THICC- Blue/Blue. On the other hand, if you can squat that way but it takes you 20 minutes of foam rolling and … Play around and find a hip angle allows you to pull your knee the furthest- try bringing your knee out to the side rather than straight toward your head. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, Discussion of physical fitness/exercise goals and how they can be achieved, Press J to jump to the feed. I wonder why they chose to do the squat study on trained females. I would advise you to go below. I think he just likes looking at butts. Edit to add: it's crazy how I get down voted for this but not my other comment. Squatting below parallel is a fundamental human movement, we see it in toddlers and babies without any coaching because it is just that natural. A quarter squat isn't going to give your quad activation as a full squat. 2010 pointed this out too). Debajo de Paralelo- Antique Gold/Black. In order to make a study valid you need your subjects to be pretty similar in characteristics - so you've got a 50/50 pick between all men or all women. Maybe a little flexibility gains. Below Parallel Squat Club- Black/White.